Posted in Mas Oyama (Sunday, May 11, 2008)
It stars OYAMA AND HIS TOP FIGHTERS. It was directed by K. KOYAMA. By Rising Sun Productions.
Sells new for $49.95.
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1 comments about Kyokushin Kai Master Oyama - 2 DVD Set.
- Someone must have made a buck on this release. Because not a dime can have been spent producing it.
The subject, kyokushin kai karate -the first full contact karate style, is interesting (and I am personaly a fanatic about it) but this dvd set is a disgrace.
The first DVD in the set is the worst.
It is available separately on amazon as "Kyo Ku Shin Way This is True Karate " and is 58 minutes in lenght.
Someone has gone trough their old video collection and dug up all their old 3rd generation vhs to vhs copies and captured them on their computer (with a bad video capturing program that "skipps" when the video signal gets to bad -which is frequently). Mixed the scenes about a bit, added a title screen in some video editing program and decided it was finished!
Im not kidding, it is old vhs copies (old, faded signal, with tension distortions at the edges and everything else that goes with very old and used vhs tapes) from the 70ies and 80ies. Ive seen most of them before, and I kind of doubt they have gotten the rights to use the material. Most are still commersialy available as vhs (in good quality), in japan.
There are no subtext to the japanese sound and text shown, but that is ok since the scenes are so mixed up that the sound (which are from the originals) makes no sense anyway.
Most of it are barely viewable short clips from old world open tournaments. All mixed together.
The second DVD is slightly better, but not by much.
it is 23 minues in length, and is available spearately "Kyo Ku Shin Kai's Mas Oyama - d" on amazon.
It begins almost the same. Very bad quality ripoffs from other releases and then goes on to some videofilms at training camps during the 90ies. It shows a few minutes of black-and-white old footage of Mas Oyama (the founder of kyokushin karate), but then it goes back to the training camp clips again.
Yet again we get to watch a lot of blank screens where the capture program has not been able to capture the vhs video signal.
As a kyokushin karate practicioner, as a fan of martial arts in general and karate in particular, I have to warn people about this one. The quality is abysmal and so far from profesional it is almost funny. At times there are more frozen pictures and blank screens due to the horrible capture, than it is actual moving movie. But with the price set for it (currently $49.95), it is not amusing anymore.
I cannot belive that someone actualy released this!
The subject may be interesting, but this DVD is junk and border line scam!
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Posted in Mas Oyama (Sunday, May 11, 2008)
It stars Nobuo Iwamoto, Nobuyuki Furuta, Masako Katsuki, William Roberts, Mika Doi. It was directed by Kazuyoshi Katayama. By Manga Video.
The regular list price is $24.95.
Sells new for $6.19.
There are some available for $1.00.
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5 comments about Appleseed (Sub).
- Appleseed is based on the manga - Mankind is trying to make a perfect utopia in the city of Olympus. But is it perfect or just another form of a cage, monitored and controlled by a computer named Gaia. Forces within the city are trying to restore their freedoms. Or are they just trying to bring paradise down to hell?
It is up to Dunan Nats and Buliarous Hekatonecles, with the rest of their fellow officers in the ESWAT Squad, to keep order without breaking the laws themselves.
The voice actors don't seem to appear in anything else, the plot is simple, the themes watered down, English is mis-spelled -Red ALART???-, the music is late 80s (DUH - the anime was MADE in the late 80s) and the F-word is used by everybody. All in just over an hour.
IT is SO PERFECT. Come on, this is the stuff we all watched at one time or another. Terrorists, mecha, explosions. A must for any fan of anime or Masamune Shirow.
- This is the original cell animé and should in no way be confused with the glorious 3D CGI creation of the same name. The animation is shoddy and doesn't compare well with many of its contemporaries, Akira this is not.
Plot, xenophobic terrorist and sappy police traitor plot to destroy Olympus ( Spelt incorrectly in the signposts.) The defence is lead by Deunan a female SWAT cop and her Cyborg sidekick Brearios, who looks more like a robotic rabbit than the formidable man-machine he's supposed to be. Much shooting and running around in circles ensues until right prevails, Hurrah !
If you've seen the latest Appleseed CGI masterpiece and are considering watching this one, don't. It's simply not in the same league and the character relationships, such as they are, are nonsensical when compared with the more recent version. It's almost guaranteed to disappoint.
- This anime is NOTHING spectacular! Is pure decent action anime with VERY FEW exciting scenes wich weren't even THAT good!
Not only that! The action wasn't well choreographied and the graphics, sound and animation were so-so.
The 2004 Appleseed have more excitement, more stunts, more action and better quality. What I didn't like was the CG animation, I hate CG animation and graphics in animes(except for Final Fantasy A.C.).
Adios.
- Appleseed is an ok at best anime for its time. Pretty outdated but still somewhat enjoyable. Just like most anime, it starts out with guns blazing then slows down a bit and picks up at times. The story is alright but it kind of gave me that drowsy feeling at times.
The anime takes place in a post apaocalpytic future where mankind is practically replaced by robots governed by a super computer. There lives are predetermined and there is a group of terrorist who seek to change this life. I found the future to look not so futuristic. It still looks pretty modern day and there was a couple of holes in the story from what I saw.
Well if your looking to check out some of the older anime "classics" then I guess you cant go too wrong with this. If you can get it cheap then I would say do that. At the very least its good for a rental.
- Coming from a hardcore Masamune Shirow fan, if you want to know about Appleseed, either read the mangas, or see the two excellent CGI films. This OVA from the early 80s is total cheese, taking none of the futuristic drama into account, and going for cheap laughs. It might fit the Tank Police series, but not here. Trust me, don't waste your money when this series has been reimagined into some of the finest computer animated features to ever come out of Japan.
Read more...
Posted in Mas Oyama (Sunday, May 11, 2008)
It stars OYAMA, OTSUKA KIM. It was directed by MASTER U.. By RISING SUN PRODUCTIONS.
The regular list price is $74.95.
Sells new for $69.95.
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No comments about Japanese Karate Masters - 3 DVD Set.
Posted in Mas Oyama (Sunday, May 11, 2008)
It stars Nobuo Iwamoto, Nobuyuki Furuta, Masako Katsuki, William Roberts, Mika Doi. It was directed by Kazuyoshi Katayama. By .
There are some available for $38.91.
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5 comments about Appurushîdo.
- Appleseed is based on the manga - Mankind is trying to make a perfect utopia in the city of Olympus. But is it perfect or just another form of a cage, monitored and controlled by a computer named Gaia. Forces within the city are trying to restore their freedoms. Or are they just trying to bring paradise down to hell?
It is up to Dunan Nats and Buliarous Hekatonecles, with the rest of their fellow officers in the ESWAT Squad, to keep order without breaking the laws themselves.
The voice actors don't seem to appear in anything else, the plot is simple, the themes watered down, English is mis-spelled -Red ALART???-, the music is late 80s (DUH - the anime was MADE in the late 80s) and the F-word is used by everybody. All in just over an hour.
IT is SO PERFECT. Come on, this is the stuff we all watched at one time or another. Terrorists, mecha, explosions. A must for any fan of anime or Masamune Shirow.
- This is the original cell animé and should in no way be confused with the glorious 3D CGI creation of the same name. The animation is shoddy and doesn't compare well with many of its contemporaries, Akira this is not.
Plot, xenophobic terrorist and sappy police traitor plot to destroy Olympus ( Spelt incorrectly in the signposts.) The defence is lead by Deunan a female SWAT cop and her Cyborg sidekick Brearios, who looks more like a robotic rabbit than the formidable man-machine he's supposed to be. Much shooting and running around in circles ensues until right prevails, Hurrah !
If you've seen the latest Appleseed CGI masterpiece and are considering watching this one, don't. It's simply not in the same league and the character relationships, such as they are, are nonsensical when compared with the more recent version. It's almost guaranteed to disappoint.
- This anime is NOTHING spectacular! Is pure decent action anime with VERY FEW exciting scenes wich weren't even THAT good!
Not only that! The action wasn't well choreographied and the graphics, sound and animation were so-so.
The 2004 Appleseed have more excitement, more stunts, more action and better quality. What I didn't like was the CG animation, I hate CG animation and graphics in animes(except for Final Fantasy A.C.).
Adios.
- Appleseed is an ok at best anime for its time. Pretty outdated but still somewhat enjoyable. Just like most anime, it starts out with guns blazing then slows down a bit and picks up at times. The story is alright but it kind of gave me that drowsy feeling at times.
The anime takes place in a post apaocalpytic future where mankind is practically replaced by robots governed by a super computer. There lives are predetermined and there is a group of terrorist who seek to change this life. I found the future to look not so futuristic. It still looks pretty modern day and there was a couple of holes in the story from what I saw.
Well if your looking to check out some of the older anime "classics" then I guess you cant go too wrong with this. If you can get it cheap then I would say do that. At the very least its good for a rental.
- Coming from a hardcore Masamune Shirow fan, if you want to know about Appleseed, either read the mangas, or see the two excellent CGI films. This OVA from the early 80s is total cheese, taking none of the futuristic drama into account, and going for cheap laughs. It might fit the Tank Police series, but not here. Trust me, don't waste your money when this series has been reimagined into some of the finest computer animated features to ever come out of Japan.
Read more...
Posted in Mas Oyama (Sunday, May 11, 2008)
It stars Mas Oyama. By .
The regular list price is $29.95.
Sells new for $20.95.
There are some available for $17.89.
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4 comments about Kyo Ku Shin Kai's Mas Oyama - d.
- Mas oyama's karate is tougher than other martial arts. I've been hospitalize for two months said my friend max lee he spoke to him and train personally.
and I saw the other training video is a must buy this dvd. if you wana be a "karate guy". he was born in korea 1923 formely Master choi Young Li after he move to Japan age 15 yrs old men he knew exactly why he was born.
- I paid 30 bucks for this 23 minute DVD, and only 5-10 minutes (and ten would be very generous) are actually of Mas Oyama, and a lot of that ten minutes is the same footage repeated (guess it must be hard to fill 23 minutes). What's the rest? I'd love to tell you, but this DVD was of such incredibly poor quality that the majority of the scenes were unplayable -- just a gray screen with music that sounded like a Japanese John Tesch scoring a porn movie.
Just to give you an idea of the Oyama/Not Oyama ratio and the gross misrepresentation of the DVD's title, imagine ordering a "Star Wars" DVD and getting two hours of people playing shuffle board. Now imagine every ten minutes or so George Lucas appears on screen and waves a Luke Skywalker action figure back and forth for five seconds while he makes light saber noises.
From what I could see, however, the non-Oyama parts were a combination of tournament footage and various guys breaking stuff. Maybe they're Oyama students, I don't know. There was no commentary, and no clues in the pseudo-porn music that may have revealed the performers' top-secret identities.
One really nice touch was the line of static -- much like the "bad tracking" static you used to see on VHS tapes -- that obscured those rare times that THE GRAY VOID OF NOTHINGNESS did not consume the entire video screen. You just can't buy special effects like that for less than thirty bucks for 23 minutes.
I gave this DVD one star because I had to (there's no zero on Amazon's scale); however, it's an easy five stars for any industry watchdogs, consumer advocacy groups, class action attorneys, or law enforcement agencies that are looking for unscrupulous, weasely, DVD distributors to harass. These guys should be ashamed of themselves. Oh wait, maybe they are. Here's a direct quote from the Product Details page: "Studio: (studio name not provided)." Who can blame them?
Oh, I forgot to mention. This thirty dollar coaster didn't even come shrink-wrapped -- a small piece of scotch tape held the case closed. Pretty classy, eh?
- I got this DVD about two months ago and can only now bring myself to review it. This DVD is just awful. 1 star is the minimum scale on the Amazon scale otherwise I would have given it a 0.
It has heavy static line that mars the picture up until about the five minute mark. It clears up but is soon replaced by a blank grey screen which flicks in an out with maybe a couple of seconds of footage between each grey screen. this continues on until about the 12 minute mark.
No problems with the picture and Im actually getting to watch something when bang! Grey screen again at about the 15 minute mark right through until the end. I tried watching the DVD in a few different machines but it just won't work.
This on top of an appaling sound track, total lack of commentary after about the 5 minute mark and the distinct lack, from what I could see between the flickering grey screens, of MAS OYAMA makes this product worse than rubbish.
I am a practioner of Kyokushin Karate and was excited at the thought of getting a rare insight into the master of this style. But this certainly wasn't it!
My appologies to any who have purchased this product between the time I bought it and placed this review
-
quality very bad , not what I expected, next time I'll think twice before ordering again.
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Posted in Mas Oyama (Sunday, May 11, 2008)
It stars Charles Martin (II), William Oliver (II), Harry J. Quini, Mas Oyama, Willie Williams. It was directed by Shuji Goto. By New Line Home Video.
The regular list price is $9.98.
Sells new for $23.55.
There are some available for $12.95.
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5 comments about Fighting Black Kings.
- This is a excellent documentary, the men in this video are real Martial Artists, no fancy uniforms, no glitz or glamour,no foam dipped pads,no tag kumite matches, just real blood,sweat,and tears,This is the way Karate should have stayed,it is good to see that this style is still alive with the art of Kyokushin which is what style the film is based on.I for one always look back to this video for inspiration as I'am now a Kyokushin Karateka and Karateka for the past 19 years in Wado Kai Karate as a 3rd dan. Its too bad alot forgot about what Karate was all about and its nice to see this video still around to show others how it should be.This video also has a funky soundtrack as it was made in 1976. a Real Feel Good Video.
- This documentry features Mas Oyama's Kyokushin Karate that would spawn other great Karate systems like Enshin and Seidokan. There are also many great martial artists features like Sato and Joko Ninomiya (founder of Enshin and Sabaki). The documentry follows many fighters from America, Japan, England, Thailand, and Hong Kong as they enter the first world karate tournement.
The matches are good, but what is especially interetsing is following the training that these individuals go through to enter this tournement. This is fighting karate and anyone interested in rugged sparring and work-outs should view this film.
Additional Note: 02/23/2008: Several years later and I still love this film. I watch it three-four times a year. One of the best martial arts docs out there. A DVD version with special features would be terrific, I hope it happens soon.
- Fighting Black Kings was the first video I've seen on full contact traditional karate. The film follows the training regimen of fighters from all over the world as they prepare for the prestigious all-world full contact karate tournament in Japan. The film cuts nicely from when the fighters are are on the fighting mat in the tournament to showing them back home training in their respective contries. Although the tournament is open to all styles, the rules favor the kyokushinkai system.
The only reason the film is called "Fighting Black Kings" is because it focused on a number of prominent black karateka from New York such as Willie Williams and William Oliver who were preparing to compete in the All-World. They trained in the Kyokushinkai system which is known for it's emphasis on full-contact kumite with no pads or gloves. The fighters are interviewed and offer their perspectives on fighting in the All-World Tournament.
- You'll see a guy in the tornament He thinks he's Bruce lee the way he dance jab,fake and yell kiap wata!heya! "Copied style but effective". and the "Muthai boxers KICK ASS"!
I would like to see more karate tournament goes to Thailand ,
Its very Contraversy,not too many Karate dojo went to thailand,
Only KyokoshinKai and some small groups.this Tape is much far more better documentary of all the oyamas Documentary Tape look like the original Scene of "The Karate Kids Story" or "The Karate Man" Except there;s no Pat Morita and Ralph Machio and hollywood stunts,camera tricks! sad they have to freeze frame some of the tournaments otherwise is cool! I gave them not only 5 stars but 500 stars it gaves me 1000 stars to motivate myself to practice martial arts and concentrate,focus in all walks of life.
I wonder now a days I dont see them on pride Fighting Championship 2004 or 2005.
Only on K-1 . and not Ufc Ultimate fighting Championship!
Maybe Nextime.!Me and Max Lee Martial arts research Lab. glim@asia.com
- I watched this movie on tv, thought it was awesome, and ordered the vhs from amazon for $9.95. That was in October, it was backordered for FOUR MONTHS, and just recently amazon decided to cancel my order for me. The price now, just days after my order was cancelled, is $35.95!! This practice should be illegal, I think someone should be thrown in jail for this.
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Posted in Mas Oyama (Sunday, May 11, 2008)
It stars Nobuo Iwamoto, Nobuyuki Furuta, Masako Katsuki, William Roberts, Mika Doi. It was directed by Kazuyoshi Katayama. By Manga Video.
The regular list price is $19.95.
Sells new for $14.97.
There are some available for $0.01.
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Purchase Information
5 comments about Appleseed.
- Appleseed is based on the manga - Mankind is trying to make a perfect utopia in the city of Olympus. But is it perfect or just another form of a cage, monitored and controlled by a computer named Gaia. Forces within the city are trying to restore their freedoms. Or are they just trying to bring paradise down to hell?
It is up to Dunan Nats and Buliarous Hekatonecles, with the rest of their fellow officers in the ESWAT Squad, to keep order without breaking the laws themselves.
The voice actors don't seem to appear in anything else, the plot is simple, the themes watered down, English is mis-spelled -Red ALART???-, the music is late 80s (DUH - the anime was MADE in the late 80s) and the F-word is used by everybody. All in just over an hour.
IT is SO PERFECT. Come on, this is the stuff we all watched at one time or another. Terrorists, mecha, explosions. A must for any fan of anime or Masamune Shirow.
- This is the original cell animé and should in no way be confused with the glorious 3D CGI creation of the same name. The animation is shoddy and doesn't compare well with many of its contemporaries, Akira this is not.
Plot, xenophobic terrorist and sappy police traitor plot to destroy Olympus ( Spelt incorrectly in the signposts.) The defence is lead by Deunan a female SWAT cop and her Cyborg sidekick Brearios, who looks more like a robotic rabbit than the formidable man-machine he's supposed to be. Much shooting and running around in circles ensues until right prevails, Hurrah !
If you've seen the latest Appleseed CGI masterpiece and are considering watching this one, don't. It's simply not in the same league and the character relationships, such as they are, are nonsensical when compared with the more recent version. It's almost guaranteed to disappoint.
- This anime is NOTHING spectacular! Is pure decent action anime with VERY FEW exciting scenes wich weren't even THAT good!
Not only that! The action wasn't well choreographied and the graphics, sound and animation were so-so.
The 2004 Appleseed have more excitement, more stunts, more action and better quality. What I didn't like was the CG animation, I hate CG animation and graphics in animes(except for Final Fantasy A.C.).
Adios.
- Appleseed is an ok at best anime for its time. Pretty outdated but still somewhat enjoyable. Just like most anime, it starts out with guns blazing then slows down a bit and picks up at times. The story is alright but it kind of gave me that drowsy feeling at times.
The anime takes place in a post apaocalpytic future where mankind is practically replaced by robots governed by a super computer. There lives are predetermined and there is a group of terrorist who seek to change this life. I found the future to look not so futuristic. It still looks pretty modern day and there was a couple of holes in the story from what I saw.
Well if your looking to check out some of the older anime "classics" then I guess you cant go too wrong with this. If you can get it cheap then I would say do that. At the very least its good for a rental.
- Coming from a hardcore Masamune Shirow fan, if you want to know about Appleseed, either read the mangas, or see the two excellent CGI films. This OVA from the early 80s is total cheese, taking none of the futuristic drama into account, and going for cheap laughs. It might fit the Tank Police series, but not here. Trust me, don't waste your money when this series has been reimagined into some of the finest computer animated features to ever come out of Japan.
Read more...
Posted in Mas Oyama (Sunday, May 11, 2008)
It stars Mas Oyama. It was directed by George Alexander. By Yamazato Productions.
The regular list price is $29.95.
Sells new for $22.95.
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No comments about Kyokyushinkai Karate Complete!.
Posted in Mas Oyama (Sunday, May 11, 2008)
It stars Sonny Chiba. By Bci / Eclipse.
The regular list price is $29.98.
Sells new for $15.30.
There are some available for $17.49.
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2 comments about Sonny Chiba - Masutatsu Oyama Trilogy.
- This is a great set for Chiba fans. You can tell they put some love into it with great picture and sound. All are in widescreen and subtitled with an option for simulated 5.1 sound. For those who haven't seen these movies before it's sort of a Karate action drama based on Chiba's mentor. They're the original uncut versions so there shouldn't be anything missing. Extras are limited to trailers. I'm no expert on widescreen, color saturation or sound so purists may have another opinion. I personally love this set.
- I am a practitoner of Grand Master Mas Oyama's Kyokushin Karate for over 30 years now. Kyokushin is Japan's strongest and No. 1 style of Karate, very different from the other styles. I remember when the first movie in this triology "Kenka Karate Kyokushin Ken" was released to U.S. movie theaters under the title "Champion Of Death". Starring Japan action star Sonny Chiba, it was a big hit, particularly in drive-in movie theaters in the late 70's. I remember writing a movie review of this film when it played in my own hometown so many years ago. Later, this movie was shown on THE MOVIE CHANNEL and I had it recorded, being the only one around who had a dubbed English language copy of this movie. Eventually, "Champion Of Death" was released on video by a second rate video distribution company. My copy from TV was superior in quality to what was released, even clearer than the dvd that was later released. Now, we have the "Sonny Chiba - Masutatsu Oyama Trilogy" officially released, remastered, in wide screen format, containing all three movies in this series uncut in the original Japanese language with removable English subtitles. A dream come true and so affordable for a 3 disk boxset. I'm sure this movie trilogy was done justice because of the recent interest in action star Sonny Chiba since his appearance in the movie hit "Kill Bill Vol. One". But, whatever the reason, all Kyokushin students should grab this set while it's still available. True, it may be loosely based on Mas Oyama's life story, but it still worth owning as part of your martial arts movie collection. The third movie "Karate For Life" contains the best on screen Karate action in Sonny Chiba's entire career. I highly recommend this exciting dvd boxset. OSU!
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Posted in Mas Oyama (Sunday, May 11, 2008)
It stars Vincent Marzello, Kôji Totani, Kenichi Ono, Lorelei King, Mika Doi. It was directed by Kazuyoshi Katayama. By Manga Video.
The regular list price is $24.98.
Sells new for $9.79.
There are some available for $9.31.
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Purchase Information
5 comments about Appleseed.
- Appleseed is based on the manga - Mankind is trying to make a perfect utopia in the city of Olympus. But is it perfect or just another form of a cage, monitored and controlled by a computer named Gaia. Forces within the city are trying to restore their freedoms. Or are they just trying to bring paradise down to hell?
It is up to Dunan Nats and Buliarous Hekatonecles, with the rest of their fellow officers in the ESWAT Squad, to keep order without breaking the laws themselves.
The voice actors don't seem to appear in anything else, the plot is simple, the themes watered down, English is mis-spelled -Red ALART???-, the music is late 80s (DUH - the anime was MADE in the late 80s) and the F-word is used by everybody. All in just over an hour.
IT is SO PERFECT. Come on, this is the stuff we all watched at one time or another. Terrorists, mecha, explosions. A must for any fan of anime or Masamune Shirow.
- This is the original cell animé and should in no way be confused with the glorious 3D CGI creation of the same name. The animation is shoddy and doesn't compare well with many of its contemporaries, Akira this is not.
Plot, xenophobic terrorist and sappy police traitor plot to destroy Olympus ( Spelt incorrectly in the signposts.) The defence is lead by Deunan a female SWAT cop and her Cyborg sidekick Brearios, who looks more like a robotic rabbit than the formidable man-machine he's supposed to be. Much shooting and running around in circles ensues until right prevails, Hurrah !
If you've seen the latest Appleseed CGI masterpiece and are considering watching this one, don't. It's simply not in the same league and the character relationships, such as they are, are nonsensical when compared with the more recent version. It's almost guaranteed to disappoint.
- This anime is NOTHING spectacular! Is pure decent action anime with VERY FEW exciting scenes wich weren't even THAT good!
Not only that! The action wasn't well choreographied and the graphics, sound and animation were so-so.
The 2004 Appleseed have more excitement, more stunts, more action and better quality. What I didn't like was the CG animation, I hate CG animation and graphics in animes(except for Final Fantasy A.C.).
Adios.
- Appleseed is an ok at best anime for its time. Pretty outdated but still somewhat enjoyable. Just like most anime, it starts out with guns blazing then slows down a bit and picks up at times. The story is alright but it kind of gave me that drowsy feeling at times.
The anime takes place in a post apaocalpytic future where mankind is practically replaced by robots governed by a super computer. There lives are predetermined and there is a group of terrorist who seek to change this life. I found the future to look not so futuristic. It still looks pretty modern day and there was a couple of holes in the story from what I saw.
Well if your looking to check out some of the older anime "classics" then I guess you cant go too wrong with this. If you can get it cheap then I would say do that. At the very least its good for a rental.
- Coming from a hardcore Masamune Shirow fan, if you want to know about Appleseed, either read the mangas, or see the two excellent CGI films. This OVA from the early 80s is total cheese, taking none of the futuristic drama into account, and going for cheap laughs. It might fit the Tank Police series, but not here. Trust me, don't waste your money when this series has been reimagined into some of the finest computer animated features to ever come out of Japan.
Read more...
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